EA/Maxis has found the Nvidia problem!

[Zazazu]

GAIN is bad. Hella bad. GAIN killed my old laptop when he was just a week old.

[Lorelei]

If you want to rid yourself of Norton, there's a NortWare Begone tool in my 4shared stash. Link's in sig. Got it from Major Geeks forum.

[Kristalrose]

I find this all very interesting.  I am also having problems with nVidia since I installed BV, but no BSoD, just a lot of graphic artifacts and distortions.  They are much worse after a longer period of gameplay.  I do not use Nortons, I use McAfee, and have always found it to be bloated and a major pain in my backside! 

[jsalemi]

I used McAfee for years, but the latest version really is too bloated (and too annoying -- I wanted antivirus, not a nanny!).  Finally took the chance to dump it completely when I reinstalled XP, and switched to avast!.

[ZiggyDoodle]

And yea, the whole Norton thing is bullshit -- their 'solution' only really applies if you're running the game with their minimum specs (in which case, you have more problems than just nVidia issues). On a dual or quad machine with at least 2gb RAM, the anti-virus software would barely make a blip in the amount of processing power and memory it uses, even with bloatware like Norton or McAfee. Better yet, of course, is to dump Norton/McAfee, and go with a good freeware antivirus (I use avast! and never had a problem with it).

Okay, I got home from work and fired up the computer the 12-year old uses. It's an old Dell Dimension 4100, maxed out with RAM (512). Windoze ME, Pentium III processor, an ATI Radeon 9200 card and Symantec SystemWorks 2005.  Since I've disconnected the modem, the a.v. and ZA firewall were removed from the startup.

This old tub has the base game, NL, OFB, Uni, Pets - and against my better judgment, I gave into the pleas and added Seasons.  I was surprised that Seasons even ran, but it does.  There's plenty of CC and select hacks.  No crashes, black screens, or other issues.  Doesn't run the game fast, and I don't think the fishies can be seen, but the kid put in 40 fruit trees, spent days spraying, and managed to get a Plantsim, so she's happy.

Maybe the newer versions of Norton cause issues.  Don't know.  As suggested above, the screwups are most likely related to EAxis code.  They have a long standing reputation for that.

[FourCats]

My spyware program just found, Grokster  listed as a P2P, what is that?

Grokster is a peer-to-peer file sharer, like LimeWire or... um, LimeWire's actually all I use, so I can't think of the others. Anyway, that's what Grokster is, and if I'm remembering it right, it requires you to download something called the GAIN network with it in order to function. It leads to a lot of spyware. So much, that it once choked my old tower to the point that it wouldn't even start. I haven't used Grokster in years.

I wonder how that got on my computer?

[J. M. Pescado]

I find this all very interesting.  I am also having problems with nVidia since I installed BV, but no BSoD, just a lot of graphic artifacts and distortions.

Artifacts and distortions that appear over time are generally a sign of overheating.

[SnootCB]

Norton is NOT the cause of the nVidia BSOD problem.  At least, not the true nVidia BSOD problem that they are supposedly trying to fix (the one that is solved by turning off shaders, not having anything to do w/ overheating, low system specs, or outdated drivers).  My computer meets/beats all system requirements, does not overheat during gameplay, and has all updated drivers.  I used to get the crashes about 20-30 min into gameplay, until I started using the boolprop useshaders off cheat.  I do have Norton installed, though I shut down all unused programs during gameplay so that nothing is running but the bare minimum to keep Windows alive.  I STILL get the BSOD with shaders on regardless of whether or not Norton or any other program is running.  This is a bullshit excuse from Eaxis, and the problem will never be fixed by them.  I finally put the shaders cheat in my user startup file.

[Lum]

I've been lurking here for some time, and I've always been curious about these graphic cards horror stories.

I have a custom rig (which I nagged my dad to build) that's over 2-3 years old with Windows XP, Pentium 4 3.00 GHZ, 1GB RAM and Radeon 9600. It has always run like a dream with Uni/NL/OPB/Seasons and BV (no Petz -*I bite my thumb at thee, Petz!*). Everything's been gravy; I'm guessing it's because I have the habit of removing crap, even though I have 3 of 5 Orange Box games installed and two MMORPGs.

However, with Sims 3 coming, I fear I may need a new graphic card soon. (And a third hard-disk... running out of real estate too). Is the Radeon 9600 good enough or is it time to update? No FT at the time, lack of disk space and too many scary bugs dissuade me.

Educate me, MATY. Am I being paranoid or are my specs good enough?

[nil]

What a funny soccer ball game?
A quite potentially multi-factor-based phenomenon is simplified as a soccer ball.  The companies are just kicking the ball to whoever around in the game and pointing their fingers "vaguely" or "loudly" at the ones they kick the soccer ball to, leaving the customers wondering, discussing and wandering... :giggler:

A whole truth is that let's kick the asses of the involved.  EAxis seems to be the more predominant one!



I personally have no crashing problem at all running from the base game up to EP5 Seasons skipping EP4 Pets (I haven't) with my homely Norton wares and other security wares. It was EP6 BV with securom that successfully damged the DVD features of my DVD-RAM burner and cause frequent loading failures (say, ~5% loading success rate)!
Most of the hardwares of my present PC wwere made in 2004.
PC specs:
XP pro Eng, 1 Gb Geil DDRAM 400, Nvida 5700LE, Norton Internet Security 2004 with Norton AV, some other security tools.

Just in case that might be related:
I've only disabled or nullified a few programmes in the my copy of the OS winXP pro:
1. MSN and its explorer uninstalled and nullified
2. MSN messenger nullified
3. printer port disabled
4. address book nullified
5. MS outlook nullified
6. windows CD burn disabled
7. etc... a few more minors
I cleared up some junks like media in the help and wmp and a few others.


It seems the RAM used is a critical thing according to Simsample.
So, what were hers at that time when with problem and at the time when she solved the problem?
In other words, what are the working range for RAM sizes?

"boolprop useshaders off" can be useful?
Does that mean the shader codes are really in trouble especially to grade which video card can read or use certain functions   They could have made more fallback settings in EP5 Seasons for video cards like mine.

I guess they could have pressured the market too much and/or been really careless on the graphical coding parts. Nvidia may not have been perfect, but the latter seems doubtless.




Carrigon,

lol just in case,
I wonder if disconnecting the file type  association betwen the avi and divx at the folder otion menu (XP) or else can help avoid the such crashes.

[doren]

Norton is NOT the cause of the nVidia BSOD problem.  At least, not the true nVidia BSOD problem that they are supposedly trying to fix (the one that is solved by turning off shaders, not having anything to do w/ overheating, low system specs, or outdated drivers).  My computer meets/beats all system requirements, does not overheat during gameplay, and has all updated drivers.  I used to get the crashes about 20-30 min into gameplay, until I started using the boolprop useshaders off cheat. 

That is the question, what is the nVidia BSOD problem? The way Maxis/EA defined it, it had nothing to do with the nVidia problem as I understand it (goes repeatedly into loading loops with sandclock and blue - or in my case purple - screen, graphics loose definition until it crashes) and it did not surprise me that they were unable to replicate the problem since they were looking for something that did not exist.
And Norton is not the problem, because - undoubtedly like many others - I never had Norton installed. Like many others - at least 20 in a German forum posting on this topic (everyone who tried it) - I could solve the problem by switching back to an "outdated" driver. Unfortunately this is not a solution for anyone with a brandnew nVidia card because the latest series don't work with this driver.
Did I report my finding on the BBS? Did I tell EA tech support? - Yes. What is the first message you get from tech support? - Update your drivers.  It's pathetic.
Now if I have a driver that works and then the next version doesn't my logical conclusion would be to compare the two, look at the changes and try to narrow down the problem. It's not the way EA/Maxis approached this though. I do not expect them to ever find the answer, so I am sticking to my old driver and my old card (which is pretty good anyway and can handle the game without problems) and have the problem solved for myself.

[jsalemi]

However, with Sims 3 coming, I fear I may need a new graphic card soon. (And a third hard-disk... running out of real estate too). Is the Radeon 9600 good enough or is it time to update? No FT at the time, lack of disk space and too many scary bugs dissuade me.

Educate me, MATY. Am I being paranoid or are my specs good enough?

The 9600 is really the low end of video cards these days (and I don't think it's even sold anymore). If for nothing else, it's worth upgrading your video card every couple of years just to take advantage of improvements in the GPU technologies.  You can easily get a newer, better card online for $100 - 200, depending on how fancy you want to get.

[simsfreq]

I use AVG which doesn't hog resources (well not as much as norton anyway) and I still turn it off and disable my internet connection before I load up the Sims 2. I always have done.

Now I have TS2 installed on a computer which has only ever seen the internet once, and probably never will again. I DO NOT WANT service pack 3, thanks. I simultaneously sim and net by netting on my laptop.

[Zazazu]

However, with Sims 3 coming, I fear I may need a new graphic card soon. (And a third hard-disk... running out of real estate too). Is the Radeon 9600 good enough or is it time to update? No FT at the time, lack of disk space and too many scary bugs dissuade me.

Educate me, MATY. Am I being paranoid or are my specs good enough?

The 9600 is really the low end of video cards these days (and I don't think it's even sold anymore). If for nothing else, it's worth upgrading your video card every couple of years just to take advantage of improvements in the GPU technologies.  You can easily get a newer, better card online for $100 - 200, depending on how fancy you want to get.

Also, get MOAR RAMS. RAMs are fun. They make things go whoosh. They are also much cheaper than you would think. Don't buy from your computer manufacturer. Buy from a place such as Newegg. IIRC, going from 2 gigs RAM to 4 gigs RAM cost me less than $100.

[jsalemi]

Yea, these days you can pick up 2 gig of DDR2 ram for well under $100.  I got 2GB at newegg for $70 with (if memory serves) a $40 rebate.

[vikitty]

Weird. I have Norton Protection Center and I've never had problems. o_O

[unregister]

I have Norton, ATI Radeon x1300 video card. I have never turned Norton off during gameplay. I don't get crashes.  If Norton were the problem, wouldn't everyone's game crash with Norton installed and working regardless of video card?

edit: The Norton is 2007, pc has 2gbs, I have all eps except Free Time, no stuff packs.

[Sivany]

I have 1Gb RAM and a Radeon 9600 graphics card and I've just started getting blue screens since installing FT. The screen goes blue for anywhere between 30 seconds to five minutes but the game has never crashed so far, it always comes back. I have Norton installed, never even thought about turning it off since it's been there for so long and never caused problems. I think I'll try playing with it disabled and see if that stops the blue screen appearing, worth a try I suppose!

Sadly I can't afford to update anything on my computer right now, no matter how cheap it may be. Hopefully before Sims 3 comes out I'll be able to upgrade most of my computer because I doubt it would cope with the game at all and I certainly don't have the harddrive space for it.

[morriganrant]

I had Norton on this pc, well up until a few eps ago anyway, it came with the system and I was waiting until the sub ran out. I have an ATi Radeon Xpress 200 card. I have never seen a blue screen from The Sims 2 or it's packs with that arrangement.
I don't see anywhere in that explanation of EAs, where they said that they re-installed Norton to test the configuration again, after they suddenly decided that it was the issue.

[MistyBlue]

It's not JUST Norton, it's Norton in conjunction with nVidia and possibly system specs. Read and use logic dammit!

If you have an ATI card, this does not pertain to you...

[morriganrant]

It's not JUST Norton, it's Norton in conjunction with nVidia and possibly system specs. Read and use logic dammit!

If you have an ATI card, this does not pertain to you...

I know that, but they are arguing that their game does not have a memory leak. Which it does. Norton is also a resource hog. You would think that at least some issue would come up with others if it is just Norton, even if it wasn't the same card. It is still a little mysterious what it is that Navidia has that seems to go "ARrRRRRGGGGEEEEE NOOOOO" when in combination with Norton. Is it that NAvidia needs more from a machine then an ATI card does? Thus card that requires a lot+ Game that requires a lot+ virus scan that hogs a lot = boom? The point is that they can not just blame Norton, there is more there, how many other performance demanding games get this blue screen with the same card and Norton running? I mean seriously?

[SnootCB]

What gets me is that they are basing this conclusion off of one instance that they experienced on one computer and are pretty much completely ignoring customer feedback.

Like many others - at least 20 in a German forum posting on this topic (everyone who tried it) - I could solve the problem by switching back to an "outdated" driver. Unfortunately this is not a solution for anyone with a brandnew nVidia card because the latest series don't work with this driver. Did I report my finding on the BBS? Did I tell EA tech support? - Yes. What is the first message you get from tech support? - Update your drivers.  It's pathetic. Now if I have a driver that works and then the next version doesn't my logical conclusion would be to compare the two, look at the changes and try to narrow down the problem. It's not the way EA/Maxis approached this though. I do not expect them to ever find the answer, so I am sticking to my old driver and my old card (which is pretty good anyway and can handle the game without problems) and have the problem solved for myself.

I've also heard that using old drivers helps.  I tried going back three or four drivers with no luck.  That was last summer.  What drivers are you using?  I may just not have gone back far enough.

On top of all that, they have already fixed this problem once before.  It broke again with BV for me.  I'm inclined to lay the blame equally on nVidia and Eaxis, because similar-quality ATI cards don't have this problem with TS2, and my nVidia card doesn't have this problem with any other game.

I got tired of arguing with TS2 tech support about this several months ago.  Here's what we know: across multiple system builds that include otherwise satisfactory nVidia cards, turning off shaders fixes the mystery BSOD, and apparently using outdated drivers fixes it too.  Now, what could those two things have in common, besides having absolutely NOTHING to do with Norton?

[doren]

I've also heard that using old drivers helps.  I tried going back three or four drivers with no luck.  That was last summer.  What drivers are you using?  I may just not have gone back far enough.

6.14.00010.7772 build june 2005. I got the problem when I updated with the next version, build sometime 2006. I get a few minor graphical glitches (sometimes the neighbourhood screen darkens when I rotate the view, but only for a few seconds), but otherwise it works fine, I get all the effects, water reflections, fish etc..

I have a Geforce 6600 GT.

[DJKID]

I run a GeForce 8600 GT, and if I don't turn off shaders I get the BSOD about 10 minutes within the loading of a lot. I don't have Norton on my computer and I turn everything, with the exception of iTunes, off before running Sims. These guys are so full of crap it's starting to really piss me off... Is anyone here going to bother fighting EA on the subject?

On a different note, I'm sorry if this sounds incredibly stupid... but what exactly do you guys mean by a "memory leak" and how would they fix it?

[jsalemi]

but what exactly do you guys mean by a "memory leak" and how would they fix it?

A memory leak is when an application keeps taking new memory to run the same functions rather than using the memory it's already allocated. They fix it by proper programming (i.e., having the app check to see if what it's looking for is in memory already first before allocating more).