More Awesome Than You!

By weather, I mean snow and rain or all four... I don't really know... but I got these copied text files from two .ini files in TS3 from a friend.


Water:

I didn't know where to post it, so I posted it here.

Interesting find Erry. I wonder if there is a way to enable it, or at least get it to working order.

I certainly hope so. Although we might have to live with the weird "invisible object" weather that the community made before Seasons.

EA just wants to make another Seasons EP. Whoopee.

Does it honestly surprise you that EAxis is trying to milk the sheeple of more money?

We all know most of all the expansion packs that was in the sims2 will be in the sims3 but in different kind of ways, I just wish they included university with the main core of the game, so they don't have to wait till 2 or 3 expansion packs later, and yes they will make more money for a season expansion pack and milk us for all it is worth, but me, I buy all the expansion packs and stuff packs and all, just a true diehard fan of the sims game, but I won't spend money on the store items when  you can find them around here. well I hope you can get the weather working cause it be nice to see a hurricane here since the trees sways and the wind blows, rain will be a nice add to the game, I think they should make an expansion pack called Natural Disasters.

You make it sound like some kind of conspiracy. Keep spreading the truth, man.

I'm more pissed that they got rid of NPC parties. There were supposed to be birthday parties and wedding receptions, as well as parties for babies and promotions.

I say "Go ahead", I look forward to it's release! Capitalism FTW!

I remember back before the game was out, when they were explaining moodlets, they used weather as examples. Like they said that if a sim is caught in the rain, they'd get a negative moodlet for being soaked. Plus, there are files in the game for stormy and cloudy skies, which seem to relate to weather. I think they were thinking about making weather in the base game (at least rain) and later changed their minds because they couldn't milk more money from us for weather if it was in the base game.

Are you retarded?

It's people like you that make things like Miley Cyrus possible.

Since you are not aware, there is this thing called the BBS for mindless sheeple that kiss the EAxis ass.

That said, nice find. I'm crossing my fingers for weather soon. It would be nice if they would put it in the World Adventures in whatever they're calling it, but if they did you know they would be shelling it as one of the first features mentioned, but alas...

Also, fixed.

TS3 was supposed to include the entire World Adventures thing, too. I saw references in the code to a moodlet for "Adventure", just like with weather and pets, meaning all these things were ALREADY in the game and were intentionally cut. We know they already existed because they are already solved problems, and thus the only reason they are not present is because they were intentionally cut to be resold seperately.

Are you serious? To be honest, I wouldn't imagine a Bon Voyage ripoff to be in the base game. Are you sure it wasn't related to a career or a location ( like the waterfall or stonehenge )?

Things like weather, actual restaurants, swimmable oceans, and countless objects should have been in the base game. The fact that they're not is highly frustrating.

Lies & Propaganda of a different sort, eh? I'll be laughing when they refer to these as brand-new features down the track.

I seem to recall that there was disabled weather in the TS2 base game as well, which was complete enough that modders were able to unlock it in a limited capacity long before Seasons came out, so this really isn't a surprise.

That was different though. It was cut for problems with interior rooms getting rained on.

In 3 there is no way anything could keep them from implementing these features from 2.

EA will milk again and again and again! Thats why people will piracy, more and more and more!  :P

There is even a piano code in The Sims 3, but no Piano!!!...(?)

I hate how they remove and later add stuff! Screw them!

And screw them for make the Sims look so damn fat and ugly!

Will they ever read when the players write on the internet?

Well, the sims aren't really fat and ugly, but given a uniform distribution across the weight range of -1 (anorexic) to 1 (Whale), you're going to get a range of, say. anything from 0.4 up, about 30% of the sims in the game, being noticeably obese. Another 30% will be on the decidedly scrawny side, but this is not quite as noticeable from 150 feet in the air, and barely even noticeable close up unless they also happen to draw a very low muscle rating, causing them to look emaciated rather than wiry.

Well it explains why this EP is being pushed out pretty quickly. It's not surprising in the least though.

The Sims 1 EPs were made because people kept demanding them. The Sims 2 EPs were made because of expectation, and they used some concepts and ideas from things that never made it into the game and the stuff of olde that people wanted back. The Sims 3 EPs were planned from the beginning and are just pre-existing crap sold seperately.

I think it just explains how they're doing it so quickly. The "why" is EA's desperate need for Christmas monies.

I personally can live without weather, unless there are going to be more lulzy reactions by sims, like a "really hates rain" trait and moodlet.  Under this moodlet your sim, normally friendly and outgoing, will turn into a grouchy, nasty maniac and attack others without warning, losing job performance, etc.  Romantic sims will want to stay in and woohoo all day on a rainy day.  It better also still include the possibility of getting struck by lightning.  I want the "smite" option back.

Haven't we gotten enough peeing yet?

Well, to be fair, you got to admit that cut content is perfectly common, and the presence of cut content isn't really telling you why it was cut, and it's no quality indicator either. Every dev team has to let go of some features they still wanted to implement/finish/debug/whatever, when the release date approaches. Bioware cut an entire planet out of KOTOR1 late in development, and of course there are parts left in the release version (invisible for the player). Yet still, you can't call KOTOR1 uncomplete at any rate, quite the contrary.

For some people there's obviously no such thing as 'enough peeing'.

Yes, but cut content is usually content that was cut because it was handmade content that wasn't finished. Things like "rain" are procedural content, meaning no person actually makes "rain". So, maybe in 1980, seeing evidence of a new, novel thing like "pathfinding", where units could actually autonomously navigate to their destinations without being steered by the human, being cut from a game would be simply a cut feature they couldn't figure out how to make function in time. But today? Such a thing would be absurd, and players would react with offense that a company cut unit pathfinding to be sold seperately. It's a solved procedural problem. There's no reason it shouldn't be in there. The same applies to rain. Rain is a solved problem. We know that they possess the "rain" code and that therefore, they can implement rain. However, they intentionally cut it from the program, merely so it could be sold seperately.

Actually KotoR did cut a planet, Sleheyron that never made it beyond concept stage.

Cutting a map or stage is a totally different animal from cutting an already known to be complete feature. This would be more equivalent to KOTOR2 deciding to cut partymember pathfinding, only to then sell it in the expansion pack: We know it exists, and we know it's complete, yet they cut it anyway to sell it seperately! Remember: WEATHER IS A SOLVED PROBLEM. They already solved that, and it already exists.

You mean like RE5 co-op was sold as a DLC?

Exactly.

What makes me ill is not that EA drip-feeds the features out to players -- I expect them to. It's that the model is so successful for them. Because as long as they continue to make buckets of money, they're going to continue. And so will other developers.

Are you positive that they can simply take rain and snow from TS2, put it into TS3, and it works? As I remember it, the implementation of snow in TS2 was total crap - with the game freezing for a couple of seconds whenever there was a switch between no snow, light snow or heavy snow. To implement this the same way in TS3 would be totally braindead, even for EAxis standards.

I was talking about KOTOR1. Considering the other posts I may be remembering it wrong, but AFAIR they took it out pretty late in development. That's why you have to be careful when leaving the enclave on Dantooine, to not knock your head on the door to the Space Map...

KOTOR2 is an entirely different story, Lucas Arts just "stole" Obsidian 3 months of development and later explicitly forbid them to make a feature/content patch to smooth the creases, or even a second bug patch. And that was while Obsidian simply wanted to minimize the impact on their reputation and didn't even want to charge Lucas Arts for it...

Yeah, well, this is the next grand idea. Disc-based copy protection doesn't work, DRM doesn't work and people like it as much as getting a probe thrusted into their backsides, so now they're trying to convert classical single player games into "Services". Sadly this also makes it possible to establish a "We're gonna suck you lowlifes!" business practice, and there are probably few people on the publishers' executive floors, who are even mentally able to ask themselves if they should do that.

I disliked the weather in Sims 2, it felt very fake.  Didn't like that it was just a filter over your screen so you couldn't actually see it rain or snow when you were inside homes.  I'd be completely disheartened if they do this effect again.    I've seen rain/snow effects in Team Fortress 2 that had no problem with ground patters and knowing when there is a roof.  And how old is the source engine?  EA...I swear...if you take the cheap route again...*shakes fist*

Someone else need to make a Sims game so EA have something to battle against!

Now they can do whatever they feel like... =(

You have the brains.

Someone does need to do a serious neighbourhood simulation, The Sims with added awesome. That could listen to the fucking players for once to get some interest, instead of constantly hugging their heaps of money. (Which is inevitable in the end)

I believe the sims 2 (vinilla) was supposed to come with weather too. I think they said that they didn't get the time to finish it. BS if you ask me.

No, not BS at all. The original implementation of weather was borked - It would rain inside houses, and at the time they couldn't come up with a solution so they simply disabled it. The filter cheat that they went with in Seasons was actually quite effective as it was the same technique most 3D games used for weather effects and it got around the weather indoors problem. The downside to this of course was the inability to see the rain or snow from inside houses.

What are you talking about? It STILL rained inside houses!
(http://beta.moreawesomethanyou.com/crapola/weatherinmyhouse.jpg)
As you can clearly see, it is raining INSIDE the house.

Oh, I had no idea... I never noticed it.

No puddles though! ;)

I don't know if any of you play the sims 2 on consoles also, but my friend used to have it on gamecube and it also rained inside on it.

I had it on PS2 but I didn't play it long enough to see any weather. In fact, after trying to navigate my way through menu after menu just to hold a sodding conversation I just gave up and shoved the game in a drawer out of the way, never to be touched again.

It doesn't rain inside my houses unless I have no roof or I'm not zoomed in fair enough.

I remember watching the video of Sims 2 before it came out, showcasing rain.  They had a couple in a hot tub, it started raining and while the sims were getting out from the rain, lighting struct the dude.  It was pretty exciting to see, and then forgotten.  I assume the filter they used for Seasons was their quick cheap way of stopping it from entering the house.  Amazingly pathetic that this many years later, with the second sequel, we still don't have at least rain and thunder storms. 

I'm just hoping for nice effects...fog/steam, rain running off the roofs, shiny roads after it rains(I think it's so pretty in a city after it rains at night and everything is softly reflected on the roads), high winds blowing palm trees nearly 90 degrees.  I want to see the weather when I'm inside the house.  :-*

Yeah but think how much that will make the game lag, having too much detail will make it buffer so incredibly slowly. I mean, look at how freakish the sims themselves look when they're not fully loaded. Weird, block like creatures!

And in the sims 2 the weather wasn't, in my opinion as bad as everyone makes it out to be. The hue changes, the sounds are realistic, you can see rain down the rooftops and lightning is very well created in my opinion.

I'm really not surprised. EA are really making mistakes. Like with Mansion and Garden Stuff, a lot of people wanted the one last patch to fix the remaining issues in The Sims 2 (Most fixed from mods here anyway) but they didn't do that. With their latest Need for Speed game (Undercover), They rushed out the downloadable content onto Xbox Live and kept us waiting for a patch with stuffed up, laggy, freezing games. Also, since they had weather almost ready for the base game of The Sims 2 i was half expecting EA to do it again. Since someone found some Piano code in the game files, anyone find anything about hot-tubs? Or is EA about to overcharge us for something that was in the base game for all the other Sims games?

Piano files? Links NAO pl0x.

The piano bit is what I'm interested in. Like i said before, anything about hottubs at all?

Not to play devil's advocate or anything (although that is my job title where I work in RL  ::)), I don't think EA "cut" anything from the base game. They know damn well what EPs they plan to make and they merely "set up" as much stuff in the base game as possible to prepare for it. They're in it for the money and they'll get every cent they can. If anyone ever thought they were in it for the game or the players, they need their heads checked. Get real. If they cared about the game or the players, they would be listening to all the forums on all the sites and none of the mods would even be necessary.

All eyes are towards simslice then surely  ::)
How did they manage weather before the Seasons EP exactly?
Could they replicate it for TS3?

I've read arguments like this like a bazillion times in the last couple of months, and to me this still doesn't make any sense at all. It's just twisted. Before I can even think about leeching my customers tomorrow, I have to satisfy them today, and that means I have to care about their wants, a lot. A product has to be convincing on its own, future accessories aren't a factor for the original product's quality.

EAxis care about their customers, I really believe they do. There's only one setback: Most of the customers are sheeples, and they don't mind getting fucked by EAxis over and over again, they might not even notice. Even if they consider a feature uncomplete/unconvincing/borked/whatever they still cling to their hope EAxis would fix/improve it in the future, i.e. with the next EP, despite years of contrary experience.

EA doesn't care about the customers because The Sims as a series is well established and has players who have been playing it for a near decade. As jordi said, they only care about customer's money now, because they feel The Sims is so big, they can't do anything that will kill it(like charging high prices for the store, or increasing the price of EPs).

I fail to see the difference. If they want the customer's money, they have to offer him a product he's willing to give them his money for.

I don't see how I defended them. Of course EAxis are in it for the money, I find it insulting that people even feel the need to mention that. What has changed is that EAxis are aiming more and more for the sheeples who are content to get the bare minimum for their money. That's why they can demand exorbitant prices for all "additional" content (which was free in times of TS1, and ceased to exist in times of TS2), and that's why vanilla TS3 feels like a raised middle finger with a price badge on it for non-sheeples.

Do you work for EA or something? You are clearly one of the sheeple to even consider saying that. I've never seen a company treat their customers with as much contempt as EA does. If they are showing any "care" for their customers, it's some half-assed attempt merely to hold their own against their newly merged, and much larger, rival.

EA is a company driven by the hunger for profit, companies arent't able to "care" in a human way. I don't think it's necessary to argue about this. As for respect, companies above a certain size aren't able to have that either. Everything they offer, they offer for a reason. Sometimes it's a direct approach, then they charge customers for it. Sometimes it's more subtle, then they want to improve customer loyalty. Right now, they obviously don't see a need to improve the latter, that's why there going with the former, and they will do so as long as customer loyalty doesn't signaficantly erode.

Unfortunately, all Simslice did with TS2 was enable the hidden weather effects that already existed in the game code.

Yes, and it was kind of screwed up. It was clear they didn't finish.

What I want to know is, why do I have all these random effects like seagulls at the beach, but no weather? Hello? Priorities! I could understand it for TS2, because it was clear that they really did run out of time, or at least failed in their attempts to add that feature. For TS3, I see it as the result of poor planning, at best.

Speaking of beaches, I'm still bummed out that you can't go for a swim at the beach, well, unless you build a pool there. I guess.

no, what you really have is almost a bureaucracy at EA, where the Sims team REALLY cares about their customers but are cock blocked by those in the higher ups(can I say "cock blocked"?). But you have these higher up suits at EA that want to make sure their pockets and share holders are pleased.  So they make strict guidelines for the Sims team(and the rest of their devisions making games) to finish by, to rush the product out, so you end up getting a lot of stuff left on the cutting room floor.  Spend 4 months spending millions on marketing to get their profits looking good for the year, while it takes just days for Pescado to fix their shit and...well, hello?  Money is being spent in all the wrong areas.  Add to this, the fact that the millions EA is making off Sims 3 isn't all going into Sims 3, but to the suits, and to all the devisions at EA. 

Now imagine if Maxis were still its own company that doesn't have to listen to a big cooperation, where they can lay out the time and what they want in a game.  THAT is the company that is completely gone and/or too busy listening to higher ups of a billion dollar company.  That is a company that was led by someone like Pescado, and who are tragically lost in most of our gaming industry today.  The suits ruin everything.

To be fair, Maxis got eaten by EA because they were essentially completely inept with financial management and manage to drive their company into bankruptcy. So no, they weren't run by someone like me. :P

As for the issue with "suits", "suits" don't run companies well because they don't WANT to run companies well: They want to maximize their short-term profits, burn the place to the ground, and sell the dessicated husk to some sucker, who thinks they can manage to milk this cow some more. If they succeed, one group of rapacious, greedy suits is replaced by an even worse lot. If the new owners fail, the company is consigned to the dustbin of history. Me, I take more of an Empire view: I see a company more as my Empire and manage in a way that it is stays intact and under my rule, and seek to crush my enemies.

shhh...I was fluffing up Maxis and yourself more than I should have...back away...back away....

Actually EA is more that happy to supply the rope they will hang themselves with ... that is what happen to Origin. In Maxis case they resisted to the bitter end, EA only did see then for SimCity with The Sims being a unexpected success.

Unfortunately we all have to be sheeples to a certain degree. Until someone else comes out with a game that rivals The Sims but it's worth playing in base form, we have to stick with what we can get. Fortunately we have geniuses like Pescado to make it a playable game and all the creators who make awesome creations so we can ignore the fugly EA crap. If there is another game out there, please direct me to it! Otherwise we have to take the base game and make something of it.

Therefore I still insist that EA doesn't care because they don't have to (until they get some competition....Pescado??)


All hail...King Pescado! I definitely agree. That is the way the company I work for is run.

I really don't have a problem with a company offerering optional features.  What I object to is the wait if those features actually are available.

I guess EA could have offered the program with all expansions already added in as part of the program.  Of course there would be a lot of bellyaching when they charged $500.00 for the program.  So would you rather pay for the program in bits and pieces choosing what options you really want, or would you rather pay a lot of money upfront and be forced to take options that you really don't want to pay for?

When I buy a car, I can buy the basic model, or I can purchase options like air conditioning, power steering and power brakes, a stereo system and so forth.  Of course, I do not expect to pay the same for a car without air conditioning as I would with a car with it.

So a lot of the whining about EA seems to be coming from people who want something for nothing.  Yes, I know gamers are fucking cheapass tightwads who don't want to pay for anything, and who whine incessantly if they get it for free.

I don't mind paying for it because I get more fun per dollar than just about anything else I do.  But if it is available now, why not let me purchase it now rather than dribbling it out in bits and pieces over the next few years?

Quite frankly, I want EA to make a lot of money off of this.  You see, if they make a lot of money, they will keep on making supplements and improvements to the game.  If they don't make money, the game dies.

I don't know as that's the debate here; as far as I can tell it more has to do with EA withholding a procedural obvious-to-include feature to charge money for later, rather than the morality of them doing this. I think it's crap that they've axed pianos, hot tubs, and weather - of which the first two were just kinda implied by previous games, and the last one would have just been nice to not have to pay ~$30 for, especially since they've already got the base work down for it.

It's not immoral or horrible or anything, it's just stupid and disappointing and likely points to some kind of pathetic flaw in the human race, that we're content to keep waiting and paying for things that have already been done, even though a nicer alternative would be including the old stuff from the start and then, I don't know, adding legitimately new things to the series.

Plus, games don't necessarily die when official support for them falls out; a lot of the games I've played tend to have some overtly fanatical fans lying about in some country making half-bad/half-good unofficial patches and expansions for them. If a game does die, well, either it was simply too complicated for fans to sufficiently support, or it obviously wasn't worth keeping alive if nobody wanted to bother.

EA not making money from making a good or improved game. They're profiting from the massive amount of money they shovel into marketing, which apparently "excuses" them from making any more than a functioning game that will visually appeal to their audience and impress game reviewers. Quantity over quality.

Feature hiding is only one symptom of the issue. I think most people are realistic enough to know they'll never get everything the first time around.

You people have forgotten SIMs 2 base game so quickly.  Majority of the EPs were already in base game it is the expansions which activate them.  With Wanton which JB found would be used for a Nightlife Expansion.  Weather Season Expansion.  Adventure Bon Voyage.  Found Pets for a Pet Expansion.  SIMs makes expansions because they do not want a base game running  $150.  Clothes and Objects only Packs are last minute additions which are not planned out.  And, there maybe a SIMs 4 around the corner if Expansions are a failure.

lol, not planned out?  That's why they announced content to be released at their store BEFORE the base game came out.  And now they're doing it again with the expansion, announcing a lovely linup of new shiny premium priced furniture to go along with the release of World Adventures instead of including it with the expansion.  Last minute additions my butt, they're doing this on purpose.

it's not like everyone expected Sims 3 to include ALL the expansions.  Dating/nightlife, apartments, weather...those make since for Sims3.  A diving board freakin' makes sense.  Hot tubs?  Pinball machines? A violin to play at symphony's? Piano's?  I could keep going...so could many of us. 

So much content that was gimped from Sims 1 and Sims 2.  It's like nails on a chalkboard hearing "It's just a base game" from the community when sequels aren't supposed to just be more of the same and wait for expansions to get what we've had before.  Name one franchise that asks customers to pay multiple times for things they've had in previous games?  We're not asking for all expansions in one, we're asking for a complete game where the features we've had prior make sense to have from the get-go.   Pool items, band equipment, places to go dating and group hangouts, clothing stores...they should of said "What do we need in a life simulator with a whole living town?"  and no one seemed to ask that question.  Instead it was a list where they threw darts at and that's what got done, leaving a lot of content on the cutting room floor.

Sims 3 was a copy/paste rush job to please EA's suits and shareholders, nothing more.  It's sims 2 slapped in an open hood with a fresh new coat of paint. I feel sorry for the Sims team because I'm sure most of them really want to make a great game for us but are tied down by EA.

I have not cast my eyes towards Simslice since TS2 came out and they went pay, so, no, "all" eyes are definitely not on Steve & company at this point.

Wrong assumption. The EPs included meshes and original colors. You could not do anything with the base game because meshes were missing. Not true that everything was already in a sack. My group have massively downloaded objects and meshes custom made by several of some dead sites. At every EP we were just confirming that custom contents that were put free for the users were just slightly made up and included in the EPs. So, they were not there, WE put them available, just that normal modders don't have immediate access to ass expensive tools/programs.
The EP that finally included a comprehensive bunch of alternatives to make objects available in game, was Appartment Life. Before this EP you could do nothing with the base game, first because it was too primitive and remained primitive throughout Seasons, BV and all previous crap. Finally as everything was already doggone, they released the pseudo EP Mansions &...
It included nothing that you could not find at MTS2. But it finally released all the coding so that people with a little patience could sew together all the EPs in one (I did, so any tard could do it).

I would also like to point out that EA stated once that The Sims 3 base game will have weather. If I recall correctly, there was a picture showing rain, with a sim looking up doing the "it's raining!" reaction like the one in TS2.

Wikipedia still shows a shred of this promise:

Curse those money-hungry executive meddlers.

(Edited many times to keep it short and simple)

Ive been looking around server boards, to share my frustration of this "bullshit" EA is doing, i guess i found another to share my discontent with, im no idle follower of MATY, but it's not half a bad place, good to see someones fixing EA's wrongs with awesome mod i guess.

If you have not signed not signed it already, theres a petition on the offical "Sims 3" forum, to get rid of the store.


What we truely need, in gaming these days, are indie developers, since they are pretty much the way forward for inventive fresh idea's and gameplay, if you don't believe me, look at Mount & Blade or Killing Floor. The sims is a dieing genre as long as EA is in power, and the only person willing to buy EA, is Microsoft which isn't a bad idea (They actually listen to customers) But thats not going to happen sadly, EA are Jackels, take all they can, and laugh.

The game took less than a year to make... they were trying to rush it out pretty fast, but they didn't quite make it, delayed it, snipped out everything, and released it. Some people are also pretty convinced they even leaked their actual game (BETA version) to draw attention to it, just like Spore.

" theres a petition on the offical "Sims 3" forum, to get rid of the store."

If I'm right, we won't need that fairly soon.  As soon as the modders come out with their own meshes in force, no one is going to even look at the EA store for furniture or clothing.  I would imagine they also KNOW there's an expiration date on the store, they can't be that stupid.  Oh well, in a year or so we'll know.  If one piece of furniture still costs the equivalent of a Dollar (or Euro over here) then we'll know they live in another reality.

The store will go away if no one buys there.  It's that simple.  So if you hate it don't buy. The only thing I've downloaded from the store are free items.  I haven't even spent the original 1000 points that you get to lure you there.  I have gotten a few items here, and a nice windfall that was, but if I hadn't, I simply would do without, period.

Yeah? Someone should do one "We demand an explanation for error 12 and 13's"

If you don't buy from the store don't buy from the store, but don't spoil the fun for everybody. For many simmers, the Sim Store is an invaluable service.

Somehow, I think you've stumbled into the wrong forum.

Why have a petition? People all over the world can have a vacation here in California then we can scorch EA

Then start a petition to keep the Store open! I guarantee that you will achieve your goal.

Could you elaborate on this "sewing of the EP's" together?

Oh, STFU and DIAF.

FAIL.

I haven't been doing much programming for awhile and am just starting to get back into it.  How did you find out that the code was released and where did you get it from?  Or am I reading this wrong?  I've been searching for sims 2 source code.  Or perhaps you just mean that it can be edited better in something like SimPE?  Or do I need to get a disassembler?

I know this isn't TS3 related, but I figured a look at the TS2 code might help with something I've been working on.

Based on the behavior from what I've seen in PC parties, NPC parties would be a dreadful bore: People standing around doing absolutely nothing, with absolutely no volition at all. Because that's what parties in TS3 currently are. Sim-socializing in TS3 is far more dull-looking than it was in TS2: The socials are far less responsive, in that sims frequently stand there staring blankly trying to dock for FAR longer, and the pool of animations is both recycled and stripped, so there's absolutely nothing to see. It seems as if at present, TS3 is really not meant to be played at a level where you actually look at it.

I assume that you mean "Sim-socializing in TS3 is far more dull-looking than it was in TS2".  Anyway, this is one of my main problems with TS3... I enjoyed watching families in TS2, but I find TS3 really boring.

I expect the problem will improve itself over the next few expansions, once they finish reselling all the old animations back to the Sheeple.

Exactly my thoughts as well. The thought bubbles are lacking as well against TS2, where I loved to watch the bubbles to see what was going on. Now I can't tell what they're talking about, if it's even relevant.

The bubbles are much downgraded. This is very apparent when you view Puddingland's bubbles compared to late Awesomeland bubbles: When a sim gossiped about another sim in TS2, you would see the faces, and the topic being gossiped about. In TS3, you just see one generic bubble that tells you nothing and may as well not exist as a result.

On the other hand it's not like the vanilla "macro simulation engine" is like christmas everyday, so looking at it from a distance, i.e. observing only the abstract events, is out of the question too. This leaves only one conclusion: The game isn't meant to be played at all.

Depends on what you think "play" is supposed to be.

Its impossible to go beyond the abstract since creating scenario means full customization goes out the door, you stop having a Sim and having a Player Character and there is a reason to why that approach did not work so well in consoles (that were scenario driven).

A Sim cannot act as a human, its all smoke and mirrors and attempts at AI have lead us to wonderful things as "stand here and look at the pretty city wall for the next ingame 4 hours" element of Oblivion Radiant (more like Retarded) AI, Gothic II ended up achieving the same effect Oblivion was going (without the random conversations as its very important someone seeing a Mudcrab that are horrible creatures that should be avoided whatever they can about ... every single day) without such thing as the Retarded AI.

Also does things REALLY have to be spelled out on the computer screen? what is the point of seeing the faces and the topic being gossiped about when the actual impact is zero and its all window dressing? the bubbles should be feedback for the player.

TS3 right now is bare bones but its not as if they can spend 10 YEARS developing the game, as it stands its playable ... maybe not in TS2 base but more that TS1 base.

I'm not talking about going beyond the abstract; I'm talking about the abstract itself.

What I expect from a TS3 macro simulator is at least a plausible illusion of a developing social system. The vanilla game doesn't deliver anything in that area no matter how far you're willing and able to suspend your disbelief. I'm all for fleshing out algorithms with a bit of randomness, but vanilla TS3 is all randomness and there's not even an attempt to actually simulate anything.

Pescado has made a great effort to invent a social simulation for TS3. He wouldn't have to do that, if the devs had done their job.

Call me a sheep or whatever, but it doesn't bother me that there's a base game with plans to sell EPs with added functionality layered in later. It let's people whose system couldn't handle any more than the base game enjoy that, and everyone else can add the EPs they want until their systerms are overwhelmed. It also doesn't bother me that EAxis makes money selling this stuff. It's still among the best ROI in gaming ever.

And I kinda like that they don't crowd the game and each EP with bunches of objects I don't want. Everytime I'd open a hairstyle menu in Sims 2 and have to scroll past a dozen and a half helmets and other repeititive junk I'd be like, "Why don't they just sell this stuff separately, or at least make it easy for me to remove it?"

What does bug me is they eliminated the ability to play multiple households without coming here for Awesomemod to make the game "work right". Were those of us who played whole neighborhoods really such a small slice of the market that EAxis decided we just didn't matter? It's a lot like how they completely dumbed-down the SimCity series with SimCity Societies, which is more of a screensaver than a game.

But even being forced into the modding world worked out kinda good cuz I've learn a lot and the discussions on these forums are much more interesting than the official BBS, which seems to have actually been intentionally dumbed down from TS2 BBS.

when it comes down to it TS3 is TS2 with a shiny new icon so expect little of EAxis

How does one see these improved bubbles? Is this only with Awesome story driver activated?

Oh, how I wish that were true.  I enjoy playing TS2.

I think you've misunderstood my statement: I was comparing TS2 Bubbles to TS3 Bubbles. There is no improved bubbles.

I have been thinking about that for a long time.

I even have a idea of what the game would be like.

But I am not a game maker, and know no one who is ether.

But I know it would work, it would be even better then The Sims games.

And on the subject at hand, I am not surprise that EAixis would do this.

They even lied and said there would be ducks, and swans in the ponds.

Remember the thing at the top of the site when they had the thing where you could try out making a Sim friend?

In back ground, there was the park, and you could see swans swimming in the pond!

Where are the swans now? 

Problem is, that as long as most of the people fall for their lies, and they make all the Millions they were expecting they don't care about those of us who are not happy.

Look how they reat us when we ask for help from EA Tech department, most of the time they just send you a bunch of pre-made answers, which most of the time has nothing to do with your problem.

And if you complain, they will say their sorry, but then send you the same set of answers again, and if you do it again they tell you their sorry and make you jump through a bunch hoops, doing thing they tell you to do, which never works.

Then you talk about your problem on the forum, and then one of your fellow players whines up giving you the help you needed, and you finally fix your problem.

That has happened to me many times.

Now I don't even ask EA for help, I just post on the forums and see if anyone else maybe had the problem and fixed it them self, or got help somewhere/somehow.

Its like with EA, sense you already bought the game, they really don't care if your happy with it.

Sure if Millions of players started complaining and they didn't sale as many copies of their new EP as they were hoping for, then they might start listening to us.

But that wont happen, they know they will sale all if not more then what their expecting or wanting.

Because millions of people will buy it even though its too pricey, and their already having problems with the base game.

They will buy it thinking it might fix it, or make it better,( if their not having tech problems).

Its really sad how the respect for the consumer has just went out the window.

Oh some companies still show a little, but most don't show any, and EA is right on top of the later.

Its Capitalism at its worst, oh and no one call me a Comie please, I think both is wrong, but that all is another complaint on another site,LOl.

Good to see not everyone worship every thing EA or the Sim makers do.

On the BBS they would cut your throat if you were in their presence, if you said anything against the almighty EA or Maxis/ Sims makers, or Will Wright, or so it seems.

Its nice to have a place to complain about them at, even if EA will never hear, probably! :-\

You guys who post all the stuff from the STORE, are my Internet Hero's, like your a bunch of Robin Hoods! ;D 8)

I totally agree, with everything you just said.

I knew they were going to leave allot out of the base game, form the start, I even told people on the BBS that they were going keep the best stuff for the STORE.

And you can bet that the Hot tub and Piano will be in the Store too.

I hated that stupid Store the first time they told us about it, but even knew they were going to do that anyways.

I think the Sims 2 store was a trial, for the Sim 3 store, to see if people would fall for it, and they did, even though most of the stuff there was in stuff packs already.

I would be fine if they put everything in stuff packs, as long as they didn't have any more the $20 bucks.

But seeing as WA is $39.99, I doubt they would have it that way.

Talk about Greedy. >:(

Pookysimslover, please stop double posting and learn to use paragraphs.  Your posts are quite annoying, with one sentence every two lines.  I just can't bring myself to read them, because of your style.

Because I am seriously fucking bored:

"I have been thinking about that for a long time and I even have a idea of what the game would be like. However, I am not a game maker, and know no one who is ether. But I know it would work and it would be even better then The Sims games.

On the subject at hand, I am not surprise that EAixis would do this. They even lied and said there would be ducks, and swans in the ponds. Remember the thing at the top of the site when they had the thing where you could try out making a Sim friend? In back ground, there was the park, and you could see swans swimming in the pond! Where are the swans now?

Problem is, that as long as most of the people fall for their lies, and they make all the millions they were expecting they don't care about those of us who are not happy. Look how they treat us when we ask for help from EA Tech department, most of the time they just send you a bunch of pre-made answers, which most of the time has nothing to do with your problem, and if you complain, they will say they're sorry, but then send you the same set of answers again, and if you do it again they tell you they're sorry and make you jump through a bunch hoops, doing thing they tell you to do, which never works.

Then you talk about your problem on the forum, and then one of your fellow players whines up giving you the help you needed, and you finally fix your problem. This has happened to me many times.

Now I don't even ask EA for help, I just post on the forums and see if anyone else maybe had the problem and fixed it them self, or got help somewhere/somehow. It's like with EA, they sense you already bought the game and they really don't care if you're happy with it.

Sure if millions of players started complaining and they didn't sell as many copies of their new EP as they were hoping for, then they might start listening to us. But that won't happen, they know they'll sell all if not more than what they're expecting or hoping, because millions of people will buy it even though its too pricey, and they're already having problems with the base game. They will buy it thinking it might fix it, or make it better (if they're not having tech problems). It's really sad how the respect for the consumer has just went out the window.

Oh some companies still show a little, but most don't show any, and EA is right at the top of the ladder. It's capitalism at its worst, oh and no one call me a commie please, I think both is wrong, but that all is another complaint on another site. Good to see that not everyone worships every thing that EA or Maxis do.

On the BBS they would cut your throat if you were in their presence, if you said anything against the almighty EA or Maxis/ Sims makers, or Will Wright, or so it seems. It's nice to have a place to complain about them at, even if EA will never hear, probably!

You guys who post all the stuff from the STORE, are my internet heroes, like you're a bunch of Robin Hoods!"


Now I'll finish off by saying: Lolwut?

Everyone is posting about how EA treats it's customers. I totally agree. But what about the employees? My father worked on Fight Night Round 2 & 3. Back then, around christmas i NEVER saw him, except for two days: Christmas and New Years Eve/Day. It sucked balls for them.

Sorry if this is too off topic.

Pookysimslover: That is one serious abuse of commas. There should be a reason for the comma to be there, and random insertions don't count.


Not clear what you're saying here. You said that you never saw him around Christmas, but that you saw him on Christmas? Doesn't that count as being "around Christmas"?

Unfortunately, this is pretty common in software development and very common in game development.  EA may be bad, but they aren't the only ones.

From my father's work experience, (along with his ex-coworkers), EA is one of the worst out there.

How's that BAD thing? They give you a perfectly good excuse never to have to see people!

on the contrary, you still have to see people, like your boss, all the QA people etc. Also sucks if you have kids. My father stayed in the gaming industry longer than most of the people out there.
Just another reason for people not to pay EAxis, the average workers usually don't get royalties.

You think that it's better if these people are unemployed because EA can't pay them?  Or perhaps it's better if they aren't able to write games (fun), but instead have to write programs for life insurance (dull)?  That doesn't make any sense to me at all.

Yes, but those are people you have to see anyway. You work there, so you weren't going to be able to avoid them anyway. Plus, your contact with them can be kept down through working.

How so? Now you have a perfectly good excuse not to see them. Isn't a reduction in the number of people you have to see a GOOD thing?

Dire Weasel: I see what you're saying.  You didn't get to see your father whenever you wanted him.  His contributation to the making of games was at the inconvience of not seeing his family and having to deal with a job.  End of story. :-\

As for other things, I am not surprised by EAxis in any way.  In a business, you do whatever you can to get as much profit as you can.  EA is a business.  They're bloodsuckers and the blood is money.  Not much more to say about that.

The EPs--I never played TS1, but it was one of the most successful games of its time, which led me to buy TS2.  Now we have TS3, which seems to be giving everyone a headache, but at the same time, gives us something to discuss/argue about in this forum. ;) However, the EPs from TS1 to TS2 were just replicas of each other with better graphics and options.  Code: Hot Date=Nightlife, Vacation=Bon Voyage, and Unleashed=Pets.  They did not make an expansion for Magic, but kind of input it into other EPs, such as the creatures (zombies, vampires, and especially the witches/warlocks).  SuperStar, I believe, was the reason for career options.  Now for TS3, Vacation=Bon Voyage=World Adventures, nothing that wasn't already totally predictable.

As for making a game to rival EAxis and The Sims--good luck with that.  The Sims is one of the most successful games ever and trying to suede a whole world to change over to another contributer of a similiar game is no picnic.  But if someone would like to try, I have no problem with it.  I'll even test it for you, but expect a lot of comparison.

Last and least, the bubbles--I use the Sims as a storytelling tool so I turn the bubbles off.  They're very annoying to me, but that's just opinion of one gamer and gives reason to why they have a cheat to turn them off.

Sorry, if there is any improper grammar--I'm kind of not in the mood to double check.

Cheers 8)