Get drink from sink - cooling or not?

[Inge]

Some say their sims cool from having a drink of water from the sink.  I can't see any code that could cause them to do so, unlike on the wishing well, where I can.   I ran a test having 4 hot sims, one of whom was made to drink about 6 glasses of water while the others were not allowed any.  At the end of the 6 drinks, the sun had set, my drinking sim became cool, and so did the other 3.   Can anyone swear sink drinking is cooling their sims down?

[broo]

Didn't work for me either. At least not the way I wanted.

[pioupiou]

I think it does cool the sims, but I need to pay more attention. I have done it (paying more attention) for the warm up option on the fireplace, and it does indeed warm up the sim (+15 in temp according to the lot debugger temperature infos). I will try to check that this evening and report back.

[Inge]

Wouldn't the sim have warmed up anyway from being indoors?  (assuming he got cold from being outside)  In Seasons I noticed that when cold sims went indoors for any reason they soon warmed up, even without any particular warming device.

Actually I wanted to talk about fireplaces next anyway.  Looking at fireplace globals, the BHAVs for the "Warm hands" interaction and test, they each test to see if Stack object is the Temperature Receptivity Controller, before trynig to run a CT on the controller (an ad tweaker for cold sims and a warmth modifier).   But of course the fireplace isn't the temperature controller, so presumably those lines never run.   Am I going mad or is EAxis?

[pbox]

Can anyone swear sink drinking is cooling their sims down?

I can. I was playtesting a challenge recently, with a sim on a house-less lot in the middle of summer, and learned 2 things: sleeping outdoors in a bed during the day will heat up sims (while passing out on the floor does not), and drinking from the sink will cool them. My sim spent two days in this manner: sleep until temperature rises from almost full to full red -- get up and get a drink or two, until it goes back down to almost full -- go back to bed .. the sink saved her life!

There was nothing else on the lot that could have cooled her down. Everything was outdoors under the sun, and the outdoor temperature did not change much during the day (I kept checking the temperature stats with the LotDebugger).

This is with NL+OfB+Seasons p2, and a lot of hacks (among them JPM's Warmth Fix).

[Inge]

Well, is it the warmth fix that fixes the sinks, in that case?

[ZiggyDoodle]

It's cooled them down in my game, Inge.  Last night I had a Sim on the treadmill for a bit; he had heated up and I sent him to the kitchen sink for a drink.  His temp dropped.  The treadmill was indoors and it is winter at that lot.

[Inge]

Well I will next try mine indoors.  But why doesn't a drink outdoors help?  And besides there is no &*^$ing code on the sink or the drinking cup to make temperature changes lol!   Surely that controller thingy doesn't go round all the sims trying to catch one drinking?

[pioupiou]

For the moment I can only reply concerning the fireplace :
sims do cool down while inside, or warm up if cold, their temperature tends to zero indoor, but I purposely tested the fireplace.
I used the lot debugger (temperature infos) : my sim reported a temp of say (I'm making up^the numbers right now, but you'll get the idea) 15 with a temp delta of -6 (being indoor, the temp tries to go back to zero). I have the sim warm up by the fire place and immediatly upon completion check the temperature again : it then says 30 with a temp delta of -6 (the highest I've ever seen).
I've done that acouple of time, every time the fireplace gave a +15 boost in temperature.
I will try to do the same with a sink and report back.

ETA : I only tested this indoor, but I don't see why it would be different outdoor : the sink gives -20 in temperature to my sim. She was indoor and her temp was 0, she drank (is that right, I don't remember clearly the irregular verbs...) and her temp was -20. I had her take another glass of water. By the time she was almost finished drinking, her temp has changed to -8, then when the action was over, she had a temp of -28. I hope this helps you.

[Inge]

Well I took out hacks (mine and other people's), and tried again, and this time I did see a drink reduce the temperature.  But that's weird I know what all the hacks are meant to do and not one of them is meant to be a sink hack or anything to do with drinking.  I didn't even patch the temperature controller.   I had a spongebathing hack ages ago but that's long gone.   It happens just as the cup vanishes from the sim's hand.

[LFox]

I'm afraid i can't reply on sinks but i can reply on fireplaces.  I did a test one time with fireplaces cause i had the sadistic idea of forcing a sim to live in a -100 snow field with only a small area for shelter that included a fire place to keep them from freezing to death, i was planning on making it a challenge.  Anyway the shelter section was a section of walls with a small roof and no closed area so the cold could get in with the fireplace inside.  Everytime i did the warm up interaction the sim gained +15 to their warmth, i checked the lot debugger everytime to track it.  I have JM's warmthfix but i don't think it has anything to do with the fireplace.

[Inge]

I have noticed that both the fireplace and the drinking cup have a couple of lines of code that test if they are the Temperature Receptivity Controller (which of course they can't be) and if so, they run by name a BHAV called "Carry bag - start".   Now this should be nonsense, but it's the only mystery bit of code that could be doing the temperature change!   It would make sense if the line read "Set to next object of type (temperature controller)" and then ran "CT - warmth modifier" like the shower does for example.   Can Primitive 0x20 have changed purpose since we last analysed it?

[Ambular]

Well I took out hacks (mine and other people's), and tried again, and this time I did see a drink reduce the temperature.  But that's weird I know what all the hacks are meant to do and not one of them is meant to be a sink hack or anything to do with drinking.  I didn't even patch the temperature controller.   I had a spongebathing hack ages ago but that's long gone.   It happens just as the cup vanishes from the sim's hand.

I'm still using that spongebathing hack, Inge.  Is it breaking something I can't see?

[ZephyrZodiac]

Well, I had a sim using the exercise machine with the skillinator, which sent her to the bathroom for a pee and a shower, by which time her temperature was nearly full red.  I stopped the skillinator and had her drink a glass of water, and she returned to normal - but I am using Paladin's norandomburstingintoflames, which probably saved her!

[J. M. Pescado]

I have noticed that both the fireplace and the drinking cup have a couple of lines of code that test if they are the Temperature Receptivity Controller (which of course they can't be) and if so, they run by name a BHAV called "Carry bag - start".   Now this should be nonsense, but it's the only mystery bit of code that could be doing the temperature change!   It would make sense if the line read "Set to next object of type (temperature controller)" and then ran "CT - warmth modifier" like the shower does for example.   Can Primitive 0x20 have changed purpose since we last analysed it?

Carry Bag is actually a misnomer. Test Object as called like that ACTUALLY is loading the GUID into T0/T1, as indicated by that 04 in the 8th argument byte, and not testing the stack object. The Temperature Receptivity Controller is not found by using set-to-next because the object is not physically present on the lot anymore, it just exists as an ethereal GUID. The RTBN then uses type "3", "run on ethereal GUID in T0/T1", and there is apparently not-fully-analyzed syntax for selecting lines of 0x12F that exceed 0xFF, which SimPE is misinterpreting to be "Carry Bag", when, in fact, it is actually the "CT - warmth modifier". Thus, the code actually works, it's just that SimPE is misinterpreting it. This only afflicts Newfangled SimPE: Ye Olde SimPE is unaffected because it doesn't even try.

[Inge]

Isn't the temperature controller one of those global objects (simtype SimPe calls it) that lives on every lot all the time?   And if Temp 0 and 1 are just going to hold the GUID you just specified in the Test Object call anyway, why doesn't the coder simply stuff the GUID into them in the first place?  Why was the test necessary?   I have never met such a bizarre programming langiage in my life.

[J. M. Pescado]

Isn't the temperature controller one of those global objects (simtype SimPe calls it) that lives on every lot all the time?

No, this is a new trick that was introduced around the time of OFB or so, at least when I started seeing it, where an object's code can be invoked by RTBN without the physical presence of the object on the lot, using RTBN 3, instead of the traditional method of invoking code on an existing object with RTBN 1 or 2, which requires that the stack object be the physical object. RTBN 3 does not require this, only that the object's GUID be in temp0/1, and does not require it to physically exist in the object list. This technique has begun to see increasingly heavy use, and I exploit this in my various macro-things as well.

And if Temp 0 and 1 are just going to hold the GUID you just specified in the Test Object call anyway, why doesn't the coder simply stuff the GUID into them in the first place?  Why was the test necessary?   I have never met such a bizarre programming langiage in my life.

Well, presumably, it is done because it allows the GUID to be jammed into T0/T1 without the author of the code having to understand endian-ness, or use two instructions to load the low and high bits of the GUID into two temps. There is no evidence that Edith makes the coder at all aware of the endian-ness of loading GUIDs at all. And when used as such, it is not a "test". As far as I can tell, the test result always returns true, even if the object GUID in question does not exist, although the code seems to consistently make an exception for false-return, as opposed to the typical behavior of simply leaving it as a dangling FFFC tail.

[Inge]

So what does actually happen if you look for an object by a non-existent GUID?  For example you type the GUID in wrong and there never has been an object with such a GUID?  Doesn't it lead to massive explosions?  How can RTBN handle that?

[J. M. Pescado]

I believe that it will simply False, but you might Error instead. I've never tried it.